Fantom-G

Finally! Played a "G" today

Finally! Played a "G" today

27 May 2008, 04:04
After stopping by Sam Ash and finding they still don't have 'em, I reluctantly drove over to the new "super" Guitar Center in town. I was pleasantly surprised to find the G8 and G6 sitting front and center, and to the right on the wall, the RD700GX and RD300GX. A well stocked Roland display I would say.

Since I'm looking for a portable workstation to take on gigs, I hooked my Sony MDRs into the G6. First thing I noticed: The keyboard felt no better or even not as good as that on the X6. Disappointing. Next, I scrolled through what seemed like hundreds of variations on the same 4 or 5 acoustic piano sounds. Do we really need that many? I still wound up liking "X Pure Piano" the best. Here you can tell that the sound quality has improved overall. There is a presence in the "G", which is not apparent in the "X".

The Rhodes sounds were also very nice. If these are the SRX-12 sounds, then I'm getting the expansion board for sure. Otherwise I was really short on time and wanted to check out the 88 note "G", as well as the new digipianos. So I moved my headphones and the sustain pedal to the 88 note "G". WOW! What an action! For the first time a digital keyboard actually plays like a fine acoustic instrument. The same sounds I just checked out on the 61 were of course MUCH more fun and musical with the 88. But again, time was short.

So I moved to the RD700GX. Same great action, but maybe due to the sounds, not as great an experience as with the Fantom-G 88. And I was already spoiled with choices from the "G", thus running out of piano sound variations way too quickly. I guess I found a couple I liked. Then I moved to the EPs. If these first 5 or 6 sounds are the ARX board - they had some little icon thingy - then I'm way NOT impressed. I'll stick with SRX-12 thank you very much.

Thus, between the two 88 note keyboards, even if I never used the fancy workstation features of the "G", I would definitely choose the G88 over the RD700GX - even at the significantly higher price.

Conclusion - from this very cursory test-drive, I would say the star of the 2008 Roland line is by far the Fantom-G 88. A fine musical instrument.

Would I buy the G6 for portability. No. Why? It's too big. You can't tell from the pictures, but that massive screen and all of those buttons and sliders take up quite a bit of area. The 61 note keyboard is almost dwarfed by it. For me, I don't need all of that fancy stuff just to go out and do gigs. In fact, I was glancing at an "X" 61 sitting nearby. Quite a bit more compact.

Again, this is where the 88 note "G" shines. To get the full effect of the "G" experience, I'm convinced you need the new Roland 88 note keyboard. It's a total winner.

Very quickly I checked out some of the "80s" synth sounds. Still a rompler that's for sure. Motif XS does analog mimicry far better IMO. And as always, the usual Roland weaknesses are there - DX-7 Rhodes are as bad as ever. Didn't get a chance to check out too much more.

Conclusion: Still can't see where a hardware workstation can compete with audio and MIDI sequencing on a computer. Thus, while the display, which is much larger than I envisioned, is a luxury, I can't exactly see replacing a well-equipped PC or MAC based system with it. Sound quality significantly improved overall. Price too high. 61 note version too bulky.

Bottom line: Will wait for cut down version with same sound quality or rack. In the meantime the Yamaha Motif Rack XS is looking more tempting. Or if a windfall of cash showed up (not likely) I'd jump on a "G" 88 in a minute!

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

27 May 2008, 08:51
Agreed with a lot of what you said. Too many repeated samples with minor tweaks on them and paraded around as "patches." I've gotten better patches out of a few seconds tweaking than the Roland sound designers put in the board!

Price is also too high, and now it's going higher as of June 1st.

Haven't had a chance to check out a G6, but the G7 seemed pretty cool...not that much bigger than the X7 to me, but then again, they weren't side-by-side, either.

I was severely disappointed with my G8 for the first several weeks, but I'm liking it more and more. It's the easiest synth I've ever worked with. Very simple and user-friendly, and I'm finding myself increasingly able to figure stuff out without having to crack the manual. That's a good thing. :)

I use my G8 for gigging and don't feel it's too big at all. Too heavy, YES. I've got a Pro Tools LE setup and my G will never replace that, but it's pretty damn easy to sequence/sample stuff on the G for use in live gigs. It's focus is also largely on being a live-performance board, more than a studio board, though it fits nicely in both niches (Yamaha Motif XS better in the Studio, lousy for gigging).

Bottom line: G fits into my workflow pretty well, and it's getting better and better the more I learn about it.

Sounds like the Fantom X is your ticket. Good deals on new ones, and great prices on used ones on Ebay.

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

27 May 2008, 11:36
C'mon guys, factory patches are just what they mean: presets ready to use if you like it. You have 2230 wave forms to make your own, four tones per patch, two wave forms per tone (right and left channels), PFX per patch, great 64-step LFO, etc, etc...

How about your math skills? the possibilities are endless.

EPILOGUE: i love my G

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

27 May 2008, 16:34
actually, no, it is not endless (at least for user patches is concerned)- you only have so many user patch banks to fill (and those will be filled by Art's coming G patch series). Still, most people don't tweak their patches and want a fantastic rompler. If they were tweakers, then they probably have a Vsynth already. I agree with the redundant patches and to me, it clearly showed how Roland was trying to quickly get the new series out. I bet you will see more patches in a future update.
Sonic Cell User Group
http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/SonicCell/

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

27 May 2008, 16:43
It surely was a quickshot, with a lot of extremely superficial sounddesigning in between some very good patches.

But it was a quickshot of the from my view simply best workstation around at the moment. That not everybody proves able to get that point doesn't disturb me much, since I'm making high use of all the goodies since week two with the device. ;-)

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 05:27
you people are obviously not dance or techno producers, cause if you were how can you say that the G is fantastic when it clearly has next to no useable synth sounds and overall it sounds like mediocre junk. Have any of you cleaned your ears lately?
there are a few good strings and violins and some decent bits and pieces here and there but on the whole the G is a complete let down, not to mention that the reverb doesn't do it any favors and is the same crap algorithm that was on the X. As if that wasn't bad enough the master compressor is a total waste of time and does nothing decent for the mix whatsoever.
How can the G compete with the Akai MPC5000 (akaipro.com) when it is basically full of 1600 average presets that are based on waveforms that haven't been updated for years, and the only excuse you can come up with is that you are able to tweak it?? My God in heaven, tweaking does basically nothing to improve the presets at all.
The Roland sound design team have already done the best with it that can be done, and if you are saying your better than them, guess what? i don't believe you. i have tried to tweak the hell out of sounds on my Juno G and got absolutely nowhere. It's very hard to improve on the base waveform unless you are attempting to bastardize the sound, other than that the Roland presets have already given you 99% of the best representation of the original waveform.
The bottom line is that the fantom series is a waste of time and the filters need to be upgraded something chronic.
and if you even mention the sh_t drumkits i'll fall over and ROFL.

the Akai MPC5000 has a built in 80gig hardisk with 8 tracks of fully editable recording.
the MPC5000 has a built in CD/DVD burner for burning audio CD's and DVD data backup, in addition to compact flash type 2.
the MPC5000 has a built in 20 voice virtual analog synth that was built from the ground up and sounds absolutely mind blowing, outclassing even an Access Virus.
the mpc5000 has ten analog outputs as standard, plus Adat lightpipe, digital in/out, 4 midi outs and a phono hi Z input.
the MPC5000 has 64 sequencer tracks
the MPC5000 has a 960ppqn resolution sequencer
the MPC5000 has step, grid, piano, phrase, and linear sequencer recording
the MPC5000 has groove and swing facilities that are second to none
the MPC5000 has a thumping bottom end to die for
the MPC5000 has 650 mb's(i better repeat that!) 650'mb's, of "UNCOMPRESSED" sounds
the MPC 5000 has 31 phat sounding filters including 2, 4, 6, and 8 pole filters that sound fantastic and beat the hell out of the fantom G the motif XS and the Korg M3 combined
the MPC5000 has a master eq and multiband compressor that both sound unbelievable. Talk about giving the mix a radio ready sound.
How on earth can you even consider the fantom G when the MPC clearly eats it for breakfast???

As far as i'm concened, anyone who doesn't use their ears and/or do proper comparisons to the fantom G, deserves what they get. A pathetic B grade workstation. Oh well, no skin off my nose!...

Hey "Foley"

28 May 2008, 06:14
why dont you take you MPC 5000....stick your D@#$ in tha disk drive and be done with it.....

You KNOW that's what you want to do anyway...LOL

I am no big Fan of the G either but the way you strut around here SCREAMING "MPC 5000" is ridiculous.....

I have never touched a "5000" so I cant comment on it...but I DO own a Fantom X...and it is FAR from Garbage. Is it the "end-all, be-all" of music production.....no. But Neither is the MPC.

You seriously need to BEG Akai for a Job....or something....

People getting PAID to endorse products dont do as Good a Job as you do....LOL
Keep Makin Music!!!!!
T.R.I.C.K.M.A. Entertainment 2007
http://www.myspace.com/trickmaseang

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 06:16
Dear foleycore, we do have our own brains and ears to choose the gear we like, no matter what others think. Remember - music is 99% of your skills and only 1% of the possibilities of your gear.

We have carefully listened to your opinion which you have kindly posted many times. But I am afraid repeating your song over and over again is too much, as is your continued impoliteness to our members and staff. We do not want B-grade members here, and we'll make it fine without them.

In other words, get a life ;-) Good bye, you're banned.

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 06:32
Wow. I'm doing some dance/trance production (or learning to, anyway), but apparently I'm inferior simply because of my Fantom G. I'm going to either have to go buy a new MPC5000 or step in front of the nearest bus and end my sad little life.

:)

More synth offerings are welcome, as I'm not super-floored by Fantom G's synth presets, but it's a heck of a lot better than some synths I've owned/played. Especially once I tweak them a little and layer them in Live mode.

Toodles.

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 07:01
Good job Artemy, this guys is a parassite and knows nothing about music gear.

latters foley..........

28 May 2008, 07:42
Why do people keep complaining about the Roland filters? I now think they work fine. I thought so too at first but now I think differently. I think they are just as good, and possibly better than the Yamaha filters... reason being is cus I think Roland has a higher frequency range when you twist the knob of the cutoff and resonance... So what it would take the Yamaha a whole twist of the knob, the Roland can do in just a quarter twist. But I don't think one is any different from each other since they both (yam & rol)cutoff and resonate the same freqs..(in other words they do the same job. I mean, my Volume knob isn't too much better on my Roland over my Yamaha) I could be wrong but that's what think anyway..
Septimo ,'^)
X6
XT
MV-8800!!!!!!!

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 08:43
Why do people keep complaining about the Roland filters? I now think they work fine. I thought so too at first but now I think differently.
Why Foley was complaining? Because Foley was Foley that's enough of a reason.

For filters... they are some opinions but for me it's mostly about differences at high level of resonance. Some are more musical then than others. Virus has filters which whine in a gentle way to ears even at max resonance. It's not so with my Juno-G - after some threshold it can be very unpleasant.
Hard On!

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 08:55
People like Foleycore seem to forget the most important aspect of a workstation or synth: If you don't like what you hear, then CREATE what you DO want to hear!

I know for a fact that Roland includes the classic saw, sine, triangle, pulse, etc. waves in their instruments. Those and the ton of parameters available allow for the recreation of classic synth sounds plus completely new ones.

The most basic synth I have architecture wise is a Juno 106. Remember this old girl? Six voices polyphonic (not multitimbral), ONE oscillator, just a few waves, pulse width modulation, portamento, LFO, HPF, and two choruses that are non-adjustable. Yet, for all these limitations, this old girl is capable of making stunningly original sounds.

At the other end of the spectrum are the Fantom X8 and the Kurzweil: tons of parameters, FX, matrix modulation, etc. etc. ad infinitum. In the middle I have other cool gear that supplements these like an XV-88, SH-32, Wavestation EX, and TG-33. Yes, none of these are the newest gear, but all are capable of an infinite array of sound possibilities.

I wonder if our late not-lamented Foleycore has actually TRIED to even tweak one little parameter? I doubt it.

I am also a pro sleight of hand artist, and on magic forums we get people who do not want to study. They wish to be spoon fed everything, from sleights to routining to patter. They will never get anywhere because they do not do the work. I feel the same about Foleycore. He wants what does not - nor ever WILL exist - the workstation that will do it all FOR him.

The sad thing is, he seems intelligent, but his tirades diminish him. Ad hominem arguments get you nowhere quite quickly. There are a heck of a lot of excellent people here who know how to have intelligent disagreements about gear without resorting to insults.

Oh well, one day he might just anger the wrong person - a producer perhaps - and he can kiss whatever hopes he might have for a career good bye. Think about that and smile my friends ;)

Thanks Artemiy for banning this troll.

Best,
Vlad
"Turn off your mind, relax and float downstream" - John Lennon "Tomorrow Never Knows"

Re: Finally! Played a "G" today

28 May 2008, 09:53
Temporary hijack...

A pro sleight of hand artist? That's pretty cool, Vlad. I used to study magic when I was a kid...and I was pretty good at it. Unfortunately I didn't do well at sleight of hand....either due to not practicing enough (and I practiced A LOT) or due to having small hands and short, stubby fingers (which made many of the techniques required difficult for me).

Cool stuff though...I've still got all my old books. :)

Back on topic...

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