FANTOM-G vs. NEKO

My only comment (since this thread has 10 page post potential) on your question is, their obviously 2 totally diff beasts; if not for cost tho', i'd opt for the NEKO. Its just more versatile, is far more open ended and just gives you more options for how you'd like to do your music. it can even become the Fantom ( soundwise via the 'mimik' software - similar to synthswipe in Emulator 2 and now 3).

The Fantom 'G' is great in that, it has a great design with a screen display that is the envy of IMO even the Oasys. With the 'G' you know exactly what your getting with features that are more than capable of creating pro music. I think they both excel at what they do. What i've personally found with today's producers is, if they have the cheddar, they're opting for the Neko/Miko.

But you've done the research which is more than half the battle, go with your ears, your gut and yes your wallet and you should be able to make a confident choice.

We're talking of two G's for the price of one Neko, since you need the Neko LX with 4Gb RAM to be able to really use it's software potential with big sample libraries etc.

Running several plugins and big sample libraries will probably soon show you the limits of multiple disk streaming: so while you perhaps can run some plugins and one or two big sample libraries, I doubt that you can use much more (doubt it from my notebook software experience with 4 Gb RAM, a Dualcore Intel and somewhat slower harddisk than in the Nekos).

I just point to it because some Neko buyers seem to assume wrongly that they can easily play endless multitimbral, while there are lots of settings where either their CPU load becomes high with just two or three VSTis (Arturia synths, high quality reverbs etc.) or their harddisk doesn't get by with heavy streaming from some big sample libraries (BFD drums, Scarbee Rhodes, orchestra libraries etc.)

Test Neko reality one week, and test Fantom G reality one week, and if you have bucks enough for the Neko, you could as well test an Oasys. And then make your choice.

Mine will easily be the G for
- basic price value relation: Neko costs *much* more than the components would: you pay *a* *lot* for their integration concept
- ease of use of one userfriendly system (G) instead of dozens of sampling and VSTi surfaces plus all their different controller structures
- 100% foolproof multitimbrality (versus having to test what goes together at the same time on a Neko)
- additional big software savings: you will not be content with the Neko content and buy software and sample libraries for hundreds or even thousands of dollars to make full use of Neko

just my 2...

I see six primary advantages to a workstation:

1. Ease-of-use
2. Rock-solid stability with zero maintenance
3. One works on a computer all day anyway
4. Lots of tactile control
5. Portability
6. Everything in one box

If you're into a workstation for reasons 1-3, the Neko ain't your beast. If you care more about 4-6, it is.

5. Neko is very Heavy!

Remember that eventually you'll have the same problem with NEKO as you would with any Windows PC: the system will get more sluggish day by day, and you may need to re-install everything, hard drive will get fragmented, viruses may damage your work... should I go on?

Neko makes me smile as it's the name for Cat in Japanese.

oh well.

Yeah, I second Jimknopf and The Audacity Works' comments.
Go for the G

To me, the most intriguing feature of the Neko is the cloning feature. Basically what this means is you would never really have to buy another keyboard workstation. It could become the Fantom, the Motif, the M3 (at least sound wise).
The biggest issue is the hefty price tag. But with the constant ability to upgrade the sounds, record, mix and master completed tracks from start to finish, is it not worth a couple extra thousand? I don't know...

I use the Open Labs Miko(37 key) It's the most open system if you like working in a pc environment. I just sold my Motif XS6 and plan on getting the G6. To some that may be overkill, but it works for me. I mainly use the Miko as my DAW running Cubase 4. I use softsynths often. I also enjoy using workstations. When I have an idea pop up, it's so easy put a joint together in that environment. I've been using the Mpc 2500 as my sequencer. That helped alot, because the Motif XS sequencer was horrible. I'm not dogging Yamaha, I owned the Motif ES for four years. I like the Roland sound, but Fantom X, just never grabbed me. I tried the G6 the other day and knew right away I had to have it!
Basically if you got the Neko, you wouldn't need anything else. At all. Anything you do on any pc, you can do on the Neko or Miko, but without all of the usual computer crap running in the background to jam up your creativity. And you can customize your controller's to do whatever you want them to. If you got the Fantom G, you would have one killer workstation, that you could do everything on, but if you plan on recording you'll still need to deal with a computer at some point. Like making a cd. I think the G will eventually become seamless with Cakewalk DAWs in the way that Yamaha's trying to do with the Motif and Cubase. For live use Open Labs would be great and give you a lot of options for your performance set ups. Karsyn is very flexible and easy to layer and split your sounds. I imagine the G would be just as good. I don't know where you could try out the OpenLabs gear. Check their website. Go and get a hands on experience with the G asap. Make sure to ask for head phones.

The worst thing I HATE about computers is audio stuttering. it happens with the best audio cards (RME, Apogee), the most RAM installed (4GB), the fastest processors (quad/8-core).

AUDIO STUTTERING is a phenomenon which simply means breakup of audio. this happens when you play back Cubase and simultaneously doing another act: eg: loading up a vst instrument on the vst instrument window...you don't just hear a pause in sound (which is acceptable and happens in hardware keyboards): instead, what you hear is snap, crackle, pop....

I tried adjusting buffering (upto 1024 samples), still this can hit you at random!

i use a specifically built guitar center daw computer. its good for recording, but definitely sucks for LIVE PLAYBACK.

as artemio pointed out, it gets slower with a clogging registry, fragmented and overloaded harddrive. i agree with jimkpnof that some VSTs use too much CPU (eg: NI massive, reaktor, etc) and when the cpu overloads, guess what...the good old audio interuption (snap,crackle,pop) ghost appears.

problem with a multi-purpose OS like windows is there are no LIMITS set for performance, so the performance capacity can easily be overrun (which is never a problem with dedicated, limit-set hardware keyboards).

what openlabs is doing is pretty much what any of us can do: get an excellent sound card, do some windows tweaks (turn background services, etc off), have a touchscreen and controllers built in...but the OS is still multipurpose and thus can't be trusted for live.

ok, ok, i know some celebs used openlabs for live performance, but they do it at their own risk.

i think i would buy openlabs if they actually made a touchscreen module fully expanded and priced it @ about $2500.00 without the funny keyboard built in, so i can actually use a dedicated, reliable, purpose-built OS incorporating hardware like the new G.

by the way, all you KARSYN lovers, you gotta realize that the imitation software in openlabs only samples keyboards, it doesn't model its unique filter, effects, and other characteristics. in other words, who wants to sample (at different velocity levels) preset factory sounds of hardware keyboards? i don't use preset sounds anyway.

junoguy, you're absolutely correct. A computer is a computer. The Open Labs stuff can be fun. I like using the touchscreen with vsti's. Good thing I don't love KARSYN or sample other keyboards with it. Personally I wouldn't use the Miko live. For me it's studio only. I play guitar in my band and plan on using the Fantom G for some live things. It will mainly be in my music room.

junoguy, I never ever experienced audio stutter on my iMac, which is just 1.83 GHz dual core with 2 GB RAM and built-in sound card. And yes I use GarageBand which is not as advanced as Cubase or Logic, and I load it up to 100% of one core usage.

I've never experienced stutter either, on both a G3/333 running OS9, a PowerBook running OS9, two custom Gigastudio boxes running Windows 98 and XP respectively, a G5 running OSX, and a MacBook Pro running OSX.

My Windows boxes had to be tweaked quite a bit for audio, but they worked quite well, aside from a failed component or two, which I chalk up to my builder's bad decisions.

Seems like the biggest advantage of the Neko is its ability to store other sound modules. Most of the people who use the Neko point this out. Its like having your whole library of sounds in one machine. So instead of lugging around a bunch of different keyboards or racks to a gig, you just have one workstation with everything you need right at your fingertips.

With that being said, I just got my first look at a G yesterday afternoon, and I must say, it is a HUGE step forward. First impression... I want one. GO ROLAND!!!