is this the new korg?!

Yes it is
You can see it (in Spanish) right away here : http://www.futuremusic-es.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=84

Here you have an another link:
http://it-review.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=826&Itemid=117

It looks nice with its modular mounting ability. However I have feeling inside are just the same synth engine like in TritonEX. The polyphony (120) and number of insert effects (5) strongly suggests it's so. The need of custom memory expansion is also telling...
(because Tritons use very old simms)

The plus is Karma tech and ability to put inside Radias board. It looks like its sequencer get improved as well. So it's not bad at all, I'm going forward to see that 88 keys version.

Hmm...

If this is indeed the NEW KORG, then I'm disappointed. I was really hoping that they might embrace the newer technology.

I have no idea whether the "big 3" will survive in this new music world.

Let's all hope that they figure it out. WE shall see, now shant we...?!

- Sammy

P.S. I'm going to be posting here in about 33 minutes -- 23 to see what is on display, and another ten to collect my thoughts.

Good night, and good luck.
http://www.sammyjames.com

If this is indeed the NEW KORG, then I'm disappointed. I was really hoping that they might embrace the newer technology.

The synth technology got its plateu long time ago. There were everything from multisynth approach (Yamaha EX), additive synthesis (Kawai K5000), an advanced FM (FS1R) to sophisticated samplers (Roland variphase tech).

There is no newer technology to embrace I'm afraid...

I have no idea whether the "big 3" will survive in this new music world.

Simply they will. Those companies generate much more money than the whole virtual/software music software world can imagine. Two major software companies (Steinberg and Cakewalk) are already in possession (or in an investment) by "big 3".

Big "3" have an awesome advantage in sound designs and it's including everything. For example things like arps what I have in Juno-G and MotifES rack are way better than anything I have seen in software synths. The same goes for effects quality where in your usual hardware workstation you have a complete suite of them. Try an usual VST synth where rarely there is such choice.

Sure the software sampler have an advantage of bigger samplesets but it's no wonder why when it's not uncommon to waste space using 32 bit per sample, way to dense vel/key switching and not looping samples.

Yeah, the new korg is not very inspiring. This is how it appeard to me;

- same chip as triton ex.
- same fx as triton. (or my karma come to think about it).
- karma modified to include wave seqeuncing.
- slight upgrade of sequencer and combi's.
- Slimmed down ROM from OASYS.
- Unforgiveable industrial design, purely there to save manufacturing costs on different models, whilst still charging customers the normal cost for that particular model (no doubt) - I make my living from being a design engineer/consultant - korg are trying to sell this as a customer benefit, my technical experience and sceptical advanced years would percieve this as a pure marketing 'red herring' covering up an under funded development program.

You said they were going under sammy - this could be the turning point (even though I would NEVER want that to happen).

Still want to try it though.

Steve

Yeah, the new korg is not very inspiring. This is how it appeard to me;

I have some "not so sure" type feelings about it too.

- same chip as triton ex.

Fortunately not - to cite from Korg website:
"The M3 features a newly developed "EDS" sound generating system based on a new chip design that was developed in parallel with the HD-1 engine from the flagship OASYS."

So it's not the same like in Triton.

- same fx as triton. (or my karma come to think about it).

At least every part can have its own EQ, But yeah - it should have more insert effect instances. But it's the same issue as with current Fantoms and only Motifs ES/XS do seem to fare better in this regard.

- karma modified to include wave seqeuncing.
- slight upgrade of sequencer and combi's.

It looks like Roland has still best sequencer indeed,

- Slimmed down ROM from OASYS.

256Mb of very well designed PCM rom samples isn't a bad thing. I have MotifES rack with only 175Mb and Juno-G with 64Mb and they both are great overall.

And you know what? They have to sell Oasys somewhat.

- Unforgiveable industrial design, purely there to save manufacturing costs on different models, whilst still charging customers the normal cost for that particular model (no doubt) - I make my living from being a design engineer/consultant - korg are trying to sell this as a customer benefit, my technical experience and sceptical advanced years would percieve this as a pure marketing 'red herring' covering up an under funded development program.

Well...

There is M3-M version without keyboard what is kind of interesting... You will able to insert Radias board into it too. So it has some merits and I personally think it's not invalid concept itself. It'd be nice to buy a keybed host then add modules depending on needs but it's very limited with M3..

You said they were going under sammy - this could be the turning point (even though I would NEVER want that to happen).

How much is the question? If it will not be too expensive I could find interesting in getting one myself. Then there are those two expansion for memory and Radias - again for how much?

"- same chip as triton ex.”

Fortunately not - to cite from Korg website:
"The M3 features a newly developed "EDS" sound generating system based on a new chip design that was developed in parallel with the HD-1 engine from the flagship OASYS."

So it's not the same like in Triton."

Well maybe, but the point is that the specs are so similar to triton. In essense, it sounds like a firmware update on very similar hardware. The DSP should have been upgraded sure, but the processing seems the same. The main change in the HD1 engine is the four way velocity switch/tone generator.

Yes I'm reading into it, but then why also do you need to buy an expansion chip to increase RAM - because it's still the old EDO RAM that you can't buy any more which Korg will charge you a fortune for! If it sounds like a duck, walks like a duck, then it is a.........

It won't be cheap - the Radias clocked in at a cool £1K - this will be in the same range as the current triton ex. Korg just haven't done enough (because they can't compete with their own Oasys). To me, its just a triton with new(ish) ROM and karma built in. Still want to hear it though - watched a video at karma forums.

Steve

I have to admit I like Korg sounds and at the time I was considering getting TritonLe. But with just only one insert effects it'd be very limiting as main sound source. Then Triton sequencer wasn't anything best and SIMM EDO ram was a serious (plus need extra expansion to jest get a sampling) drawback. And keybed is just awful in TritonLe/TR (Juno-G has much better action thought keys are somewhat shorter).

Imho M3 isn't using any chips from Triton but the fact remains - its specs are so close to a vanilla Triton. It's nothing terrible thought and a Triton is usable even today. It's good it got per timbre EQ at last. And it's nice it will be available just as module without keyboard.

If the M3 comes out for 1599 for the 61-key, Korg might have hit the jackpot.



---------------------------------------------------------------
If at first you dont succeed, then skydiving is definitively not for you.

Doesn't that M3 thing look really bulky and heavy? I can't imagine getting one delivered to me -- or picking one up from a music store.

- SJ

Good night, and good luck.
http://www.sammyjames.com

Doesn't that M3 thing look really bulky and heavy? I can't imagine getting one delivered to me -- or picking one up from a music store.

Not for me - looking at the 61 key version it doesn't seem much bigger than Juno-G. M3 case isn't too deep at least what is a curse with Motifs.

I can not really understand why some keyboards have to be so large? It's best looking at the Motif XS8 which is freaking huge. There some so called portable pianos with similar keybeds but without such big cases. On Motifator forums someone even opened his MotifES8 and it's almost empty space inside... Make me wonder....

Well if you want a full size keyboard you can't slim on width and depth. Sure, most of the electronics will around the screen area - look at the XR - same engine as my X8 but a fraction of the size.

This would enable you to bring in the sides but then unless it's done REALLY well it would look stupid - but not as bad as the new Korg ;¬) where they haven't been able to develop four models - 61, 76, 88 plus rack. It's the same module just pushed into a different keybed. Makes a load of sense from design/manufacturing/cost point of view but please don't tell me it's a customer benefit - it looks rubbish! It's the absolute opposite from the new V synth which (for once) I agree with Roland on their industrial design blurb.

Steve

Well if you want a full size keyboard you can't slim on width and depth. Sure, most of the electronics will around the screen area - look at the XR - same engine as my X8 but a fraction of the size.

This would enable you to bring in the sides but then unless it's done REALLY well it would look stupid - but not as bad as the new Korg ;¬)

Well... what I'm complaining about is Motif's case depth. It's meaningless how it's looking if moving it is a hard task.
I have A33 and MotifES rack and thought they need few more cables than standalone ES7 to run I can put them into my car. Yeah and I can carry them without too much strain just alone too. It'd not be so with ES7 and would be totally masochistic with something like XS8.

Does Juno-G look stupid? Imho it doesn't and when it comes to convenience (and preservation of my spinal cord) such compactness is a great asset.

where they haven't been able to develop four models - 61, 76, 88 plus rack. It's the same module just pushed into a different keybed. Makes a load of sense from design/manufacturing/cost point of view but please don't tell me it's a customer benefit - it looks rubbish!

If it will translate to lower prices then I have nothing against. What is worse it's use of white colour what has a toilet like taste to me.

There will be also a plus of being able to buy just a module (called M3-m) for those what have a midi keyboard controller already. It will be after long time a keyboard less version of workstation will have all features intact (including sequencer and sampler).

It's the absolute opposite from the new V synth which (for once) I agree with Roland on their industrial design blurb.

Yeah and it's black.

"If it will translate to lower prices then I have nothing against. What is worse it's use of white colour what has a toilet like taste to me."

IMHO, korg will ask the same money for it as current workstations. I would agree, if it could undercut say the new XS7 significantly then it has market position. But it won't. It may drop in price significantly though if it doesn't sell - let the market decide.

I don't gig, so portability is not an issue for me but I can appreciate the problem with bulk. I was surprised also with the size of the ES7, had to flatten all my back seats to get it in. But once up on stands, its OK excet for the annoying chamfer under the keys so it tries to slip of the stand - which it probably would if wasn't so heavy!

Anway radek, isn't part of the fun with hardware the sheer size and presence it has? Ask your mates round to have a look at your studio with lots of keys and a mixing desk big enough to land a harrier jump jet on and everybody's saying 'cool'. Come and see my computer doesn't really have the same impact.

Steve